'Nutrobal'- old school?

[Mel]

Hi,
My vet says that Nutrobal is out dated and that there are much better suppliments on the market such as Reptavite. He says that Repavite contains important amino acids that aren't present in the Nutrobal. Any thoughts???

[Kirkie]

Hi Mel. I posted something similar a few weeks ago. I'd read in Andy Highfield's book to avoid supplements which contained Amino Acids. I'd been using Reptavite for a couple of years but the general consensus was to use Nutrobal which does not contain amino acids. Whether this is the reason to use it or just that it does the job wasn't established.

Things move so fast and I'm no vet , I'm just trying to find the reasoning behind the comment in the Tortoise and Turtle feeding manual!! I'm a slow reader, Ill let you know

[Kirkie]

Me again

This link, has the same text as the book. It mentions Amino Acid free supplements under PRACTICAL GUIDELINES. http://www.tortoisetrust.org/articles/webdiet.htm

In another article by the same author he indicates that a varied diet is the key to the provision of the correct Amino Acids. So they are obviousy essential but it may be the method of delivery that in question.
http://www.anapsid.org/dietcons.html

[Mel]

Hi Kirkie,
Thanks, I read the same thing in the manual and when I mentioned this to the vet he said that in his opinion the amino acids in Reptavite are essential and not 'additional'. He also said that Nutrobal, if used, should only be given every 3 or 4 days, as some of the vitamins contained are fat soluble and can be overdosed, especially vit A He said that Reptavite is the ONLY product on the market which has the correct balance of calcium and multivitamins.

[Kirkie]

Oh Gawd something else to worry about The thing with amino acids (in humans) is that the body can't synthesize them all so we get them from food. I think what the TT article is saying that given a varied enought diet supplementation isn't needed. Maybe supplements containing Amino Acids are geared toward a less varied diet. Reptavite is advertised a herbiverous reptile supplement, not strictly a tortoise supplement. It could be geared towards reptiles with a less natural or as varied a diet as my torts get. On the other hand who am I to say that the diet I feed contains all the amino acids a tortoise needs.?

On the subject of how often i useCalcium every day, Nutrobal every 3 days. Main reason for this is that I use megaray lamps for all my torts now and I fell the D3 requirement is virtually covered by the lamps. Plus they're outside in the summer.

On the subject of Vitamin A, this is synthasised from carotene in plants so they should get a good amount from their diet.

Reptivite contains 34000iu Vitamin A per Kg. The only figures I can find for Nutrobal are from a website which states 630iu per Gram, so by my maths 63000 per Kg, neraly double that in Reptavite.

I cant find a detailled breakdown for Nutrobal on their site www.arkpets.co.uk but they do say to use Nutrobal for "growing" animals,

[shafach]

another thing for a newbie like me to worry about...

[Mel]

Mine field isn't it

Kirkie re the vit A; apparently Reptavite is a repton and calcium mix which 'waters down' the multivitamins and gives the correct amount of calcium????????

It's all too much for my tiny brain

[Kirkie]

Yep looks like Reptivite has a slight calcium advantage over Nutrobal 260mg per gram to Nutrobal's 200.

You're right it is a minefield!!!!

I've found the Andy Highfield reasoning:
Amino Acids..."theres a link to liver and kidney damage, gout and calcium loss".

This was from human research, not tortoises. All this science is hurting my head , I'm off to look at the baby tortoises in the pictures area

There is another reason I'm dubious about Reptivite, but I couldn't possibly post it on here

[Mel]

Well.....I have to say I was a little concerned when said vet gave me a diet sheet that listed broccoli as a good food for torts and seemed to be suggesting pellets were a 'convenient, well balanced' diet. I think I'll stick with the nutrobal and limestone flour, with a side dish of natural chalk and cuttlefish
Thanks Kirkie

[Kirkie]

Ahh what the heck. Post and be damned..

I rehomed a Hermanns a few months ago, the paperwork said 2006, Slovenia , as usual, but in my view Floyd is at least 4. Anyway the previous holder of the licence was listed as XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX. I thought it looked familiar cause its the same address as for XXXX XXX XXX, the address thats on a tub of XXXXXXXXX! So are they involved in the import of Slovenian Hermanns ?


Feel free to delete this post if it in any way puts SW at risk.

All names and addresses removed..

Please PM Kirkie if you want this info

Thanks

stells